|
|
Post by Sehlat Vie on Jun 6, 2024 2:46:13 GMT
Okay, now that's it's finished, I put together my thoughts on the series as a whole; disappointments (many) and appreciations (some). This is not a hater post; I rooted for DSC to succeed for years, but now that it's over? I can look it at DSC more objectively as a whole, not pieces to a puzzle that I hope will fit someday. Granted the show didn't get the sixth season it wanted, but over the last few years, I repeatedly saw the series double down on some of its greatest flaws. I have a feeling that if the show got a sixth season, we'd just get more of the same...and that epilogue would've taken four hours.  My full review of Star Trek Discovery.
|
|
|
|
Post by nombrecomun on Jun 6, 2024 3:14:16 GMT
Good review and no, you won't come off as an anti-woke person for naming its faults.
I suppose the one sort of disagreement I have with you is: "Star Trek rarely had grandiose villains; that’s a Star Wars thing".
I don't disagree with that statement but can't quite agree either. It does seems like Trek has been trying to replicate Khan since '82... at least in the movies with some of that quite dominant in these nu Trek series. What was rare then is common now....and cheaply done so too.
|
|
|
|
Post by Sehlat Vie on Jun 6, 2024 13:22:17 GMT
Good review and no, you won't come off as an anti-woke person for naming its faults. I suppose the one sort of disagreement I have with you is: "Star Trek rarely had grandiose villains; that’s a Star Wars thing". I don't disagree with that statement but can't quite agree either. It does seems like Trek has been trying to replicate Khan since '82... at least in the movies with some of that quite dominant in these nu Trek series. What was rare then is common now....and cheaply done so too. In the movies, yes, absolutely. They've been chasing Khan since 1982, I agree. In the series, however, not so much. Khan didn't really have much impact on TNG, DS9, VGR or ENT. I lump DSC in with other televised Trek, even if it's streaming. However, your point still works since Alex Kurtzman is producer on the last three Trek films, which very much did do Khan-type villains in each film (including Khan himself). |
|
|
|
Post by SherlockHolmes on Jun 6, 2024 22:29:21 GMT
I hated the 32nd century thing, and how little technology has improved with Warp drive. I expected in the 32nd century, replicators should've advanced enough to replicate dilithium, and that also, moved on to another form of propulsion besides warp drive and dilithium.
They finally got the characters more relatable and less stand offish. For some reason I absolutely love the new first officer, after they stopped TRYING to make him an asshole.
Someone I really noticed absent this season is Lt. Debner....of yes...Debner. She got a more advanced prosthesis for her head..but...in the 24th century they could have given her an even more normal looking prosthesis. Heck, even give her back her hair follicles that are missing on the side of her head. Here we are, in the 32nd century, and all they could do is make it look smaller? SERIOUSLY??? They unborgified 7 of 9 to the point that she just had a small piece over her eye. Again, 24th century tech. 8 century's later, they haven't improved on that?
I am not a fan of the detached parts on the starships either. Is warp plasma suddenly invisible? Is it being transmitted now? Wow that super advanced...but you still use dilithium and still can't synthesize it...
They dropped all character development for Tilly.
Something I have noticed. It seems Strange New Worlds has gone a long way to disconnect itself from Discovery. The styles, the new uniforms, the revamping of the Enterprise. Still don't like the revamp of the Xenomorph...er Gorn...er Gornomorph, but It feels like a show that doesn't even exist in the same Universe that Discovery did. Discovery (and ST: Picard) set up a universe that was very unfamiliar to me. It was so dystopian. Get to the 32nd century...its...still Dystopian. Like why is everything so damned Dystopian?
Discovery in season 3 went from being the ugliest looking ship in the fleet, to the nicest looking ship in the fleet. By that I mean, the 32nd century starships look so horrible that they made the discovery look good.
|
|
|
|
Post by Sehlat Vie on Jun 7, 2024 1:05:34 GMT
I hated the 32nd century thing, and how little technology has improved with Warp drive. I expected in the 32nd century, replicators should've advanced enough to replicate dilithium, and that also, moved on to another form of propulsion besides warp drive and dilithium. They finally got the characters more relatable and less stand offish. For some reason I absolutely love the new first officer, after they stopped TRYING to make him an asshole. Someone I really noticed absent this season is Lt. Debner....of yes...Debner. She got a more advanced prosthesis for her head..but...in the 24th century they could have given her an even more normal looking prosthesis. Heck, even give her back her hair follicles that are missing on the side of her head. Here we are, in the 32nd century, and all they could do is make it look smaller? SERIOUSLY??? They unborgified 7 of 9 to the point that she just had a small piece over her eye. Again, 24th century tech. 8 century's later, they haven't improved on that? I am not a fan of the detached parts on the starships either. Is warp plasma suddenly invisible? Is it being transmitted now? Wow that super advanced...but you still use dilithium and still can't synthesize it... They dropped all character development for Tilly. Something I have noticed. It seems Strange New Worlds has gone a long way to disconnect itself from Discovery. The styles, the new uniforms, the revamping of the Enterprise. Still don't like the revamp of the Xenomorph...er Gorn...er Gornomorph, but It feels like a show that doesn't even exist in the same Universe that Discovery did. Discovery (and ST: Picard) set up a universe that was very unfamiliar to me. It was so dystopian. Get to the 32nd century...its...still Dystopian. Like why is everything so damned Dystopian? Discovery in season 3 went from being the ugliest looking ship in the fleet, to the nicest looking ship in the fleet. By that I mean, the 32nd century starships look so horrible that they made the discovery look good. I guess no one consulted anyone familiar with ST IV or TNG about recrystallizing dilithium technology; which Scotty & Spock pioneered, and was perfected in Geordi's time...800 years earlier. Couldn't all of that post-Burn 'ruined' dilithium just be recrystallized? And if they can restore dilithium with recrystallization, then replication wouldn't be far behind. And yes, I love SNW, but I HATE the xenomorphs--er, Gorn. They feel like a cheap ripoff of ALIEN instead of an update of the actual Gorn we all remember. Their young are also a ripoff of the baby Tharks from "John Carter of Mars" (books and movie). Beings that eat each other at birth would NOT be a spacefaring civilization. That's just nonsense. It's like having an astronaut corps of rattlesnakes. |
|
|
|
Post by Prometheus59650 on Jun 15, 2024 17:31:54 GMT
I hated the 32nd century thing, and how little technology has improved with Warp drive. I expected in the 32nd century, replicators should've advanced enough to replicate dilithium, and that also, moved on to another form of propulsion besides warp drive and dilithium. They finally got the characters more relatable and less stand offish. For some reason I absolutely love the new first officer, after they stopped TRYING to make him an asshole. Someone I really noticed absent this season is Lt. Debner....of yes...Debner. She got a more advanced prosthesis for her head..but...in the 24th century they could have given her an even more normal looking prosthesis. Heck, even give her back her hair follicles that are missing on the side of her head. Here we are, in the 32nd century, and all they could do is make it look smaller? SERIOUSLY??? They unborgified 7 of 9 to the point that she just had a small piece over her eye. Again, 24th century tech. 8 century's later, they haven't improved on that? I am not a fan of the detached parts on the starships either. Is warp plasma suddenly invisible? Is it being transmitted now? Wow that super advanced...but you still use dilithium and still can't synthesize it... They dropped all character development for Tilly. Something I have noticed. It seems Strange New Worlds has gone a long way to disconnect itself from Discovery. The styles, the new uniforms, the revamping of the Enterprise. Still don't like the revamp of the Xenomorph...er Gorn...er Gornomorph, but It feels like a show that doesn't even exist in the same Universe that Discovery did. Discovery (and ST: Picard) set up a universe that was very unfamiliar to me. It was so dystopian. Get to the 32nd century...its...still Dystopian. Like why is everything so damned Dystopian? Discovery in season 3 went from being the ugliest looking ship in the fleet, to the nicest looking ship in the fleet. By that I mean, the 32nd century starships look so horrible that they made the discovery look good. The energy for the nacelles is being transmitted, which seems ridiculous to me. Yes, there are reasons that it would be a benefit to basically separate the ship into five pieces and choreograph that movement. There are times when that would be ideal. Day-to-day? Unless physics works differently in that universe, there would be unnecessary energy loss transmitting power to the nacelles. So. Why? Answer is, "So they look "extra future" all the time." |
|
|
|
Post by nombrecomun on Jun 15, 2024 18:47:41 GMT
Something I have noticed. It seems Strange New Worlds has gone a long way to disconnect itself from Discovery. The styles, the new uniforms, the revamping of the Enterprise. Still don't like the revamp of the Xenomorph...er Gorn...er Gornomorph, but It feels like a show that doesn't even exist in the same Universe that Discovery did. Discovery (and ST: Picard) set up a universe that was very unfamiliar to me. It was so dystopian. Get to the 32nd century...its...still Dystopian. Like why is everything so damned Dystopian? And I'm totally fine with SNW distancing itself from the rest of this nu-Trek. It at least retains much of the spirit of actual Star Trek. This one and Prodigy. As for the dystopian part, well.....I get it. I don't like it but I get it as a post 9/11 product. Even ENT back in the day changed in its S3 as well as the reimagined BSG. I can imagine younger folks watching TOS and TNG with disbelief as to how perhaps naive it looks. I wish TPTB were better storytellers so they could figure out some type of middle-ground. The future doesn't have to necessarily be seen through rose coloured glasses but it also doesn't have to be bleak either. In the end I am reminded that these are products just like in a restaurant. There's a meat eaters plate, there's a seafood platter. There might even be a vegetarian option. You pick what suits you based on who you are. That's Star Trek. That's Star Wars. Even within a franchise we no longer have a shared experience. |
|
|
|
Post by Prometheus59650 on Jun 15, 2024 19:28:47 GMT
As for the whole dilithium thing, the story was more suited to a TOS era problem.
Even by the time we closed out Voyager there were multiple avenues open (Slipstream, Transwarp conduits, etc.) for FTL travel.
The only way that dilithum-centered warp travel hadn't found itself relegated to the mode of FTL for pirates, and third-rate powers is if ALL that research just STOPPED.
For 800 years.
|
|
|
|
Post by SherlockHolmes on Jun 17, 2024 16:23:26 GMT
As for the whole dilithium thing, the story was more suited to a TOS era problem. Even by the time we closed out Voyager there were multiple avenues open (Slipstream, Transwarp conduits, etc.) for FTL travel. The only way that dilithum-centered warp travel hadn't found itself relegated to the mode of FTL for pirates, and third-rate powers is if ALL that research just STOPPED. For 800 years. Remember Coaxial Drive? What about whatever the heck the Xindi were using? I'm still not convinced you need Dilithium for the warp drives of Quantum Singularity vessels like Romulan ships (I was always under the impression they mined Dilithium to sell). And remember that baraton(or whatever) wave drive that they were testing in that one TNG episode with Alexander and the almost extinct snake creatures Riker and Worf had to save? You are telling me that none of these got developed? Also, do you even need warp drive for quantum slipstream? I mean I know it requires a lot of power to the deflector. Also, surely somebody was able to take the bajoran wormhole to the gamma quadrant for help. (Assuming the dominion had changed their ways). It just seems that FTL being stuck with Dilithum is dumb. Also, it can't be the only magical reaction stabilizer in the universe. I was put off by Discovery's dystopian , nightmarish, 1st season with aliens that pretend to be klingons. I loved the 2nd season. Anson mount mainly carrying it, but more of teamwork from the cast. But season 3 shot every thing straight to hell in a Mendela effect-ed fruit of the loom basket. Season 4 is yuck. Season 5 was actually better than the previous 2 seasons. But I still cant get over the setting. It irks me. Yeah, there was never any mention that Romulans used dilithium at all, just their artificial singularities. And, yeah, I remember that episode with the surfing warp field--the soloton wave. |
|
|
|
Post by Prometheus59650 on Jun 17, 2024 19:16:37 GMT
As for the whole dilithium thing, the story was more suited to a TOS era problem. Even by the time we closed out Voyager there were multiple avenues open (Slipstream, Transwarp conduits, etc.) for FTL travel. The only way that dilithum-centered warp travel hadn't found itself relegated to the mode of FTL for pirates, and third-rate powers is if ALL that research just STOPPED. For 800 years. Remember Coaxial Drive? What about whatever the heck the Xindi were using? I'm still not convinced you need Dilithium for the warp drives of Quantum Singularity vessels like Romulan ships (I was always under the impression they mined Dilithium to sell). And remember that baraton(or whatever) wave drive that they were testing in that one TNG episode with Alexander and the almost extinct snake creatures Riker and Worf had to save? You are telling me that none of these got developed? Also, do you even need warp drive for quantum slipstream? I mean I know it requires a lot of power to the deflector. Also, surely somebody was able to take the bajoran wormhole to the gamma quadrant for help. (Assuming the dominion had changed their ways). It just seems that FTL being stuck with Dilithum is dumb. Also, it can't be the only magical reaction stabilizer in the universe. I was put off by Discovery's dystopian , nightmarish, 1st season with aliens that pretend to be klingons. I loved the 2nd season. Anson mount mainly carrying it, but more of teamwork from the cast. But season 3 shot every thing straight to hell in a Mendela effect-ed fruit of the loom basket. Season 4 is yuck. Season 5 was actually better than the previous 2 seasons. But I still cant get over the setting. It irks me. Yeah, there was never any mention that Romulans used dilithium at all, just their artificial singularities. And, yeah, I remember that episode with the surfing warp field--the soloton wave. Yeah, there was never any mention that Romulans used dilithium at all, just their artificial singularities. And, yeah, I remember that episode with the surfing warp field--the soloton wave. Even if I credit them for, sure, for whatever reason, all of these ideas were filed away, though I can't imagine why because transwarp conduits and slipstream drives were orders of magnitude faster, there's a problem. Boom! Dilithiunm-based FTL is essentially crippled. Now's the time to get all that other research out of mothballs. Now's the time to unbury the spore drive. As I said, this story fits between TOS and the films, not post Voyager +1,000 years. I've said the same thing: Mount carried S2 all by himself. Jason Isaacs made S1, S3? I really only remember the MU episodes that marked Yeoh's exit and that needless Guardian cameo. S4? Colorless, bland Starfleet with, as discussed, a plot that makes no real sense. I did like the last couple of episodes where they actually made contact. nicely written and very Trek. I like S5 honestly more than I disliked it, though it still has a boatload of problems. |
|
|
|
Post by SherlockHolmes on Jun 20, 2024 21:36:56 GMT
wow, I'm not sure what you all are seeing, but I am seeing Prom's First line of his response as my last line in my response. Weird.
|
|
|
|
Post by Prometheus59650 on Jun 20, 2024 23:33:10 GMT
wow, I'm not sure what you all are seeing, but I am seeing Prom's First line of his response as my last line in my response. Weird. Yeah, that was me accidentally mistaking "Edit" for "Quote" again. Sorry. |
|
|
|
Post by SherlockHolmes on Jun 21, 2024 14:33:05 GMT
Oh Lol!!!
|
|
I am so sorry...