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Post by Prometheus59650 on Jun 12, 2023 14:32:20 GMT
Here.
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Post by ashleytinger on Jun 15, 2023 12:43:32 GMT
SPOILERS
Yay! Regular Klingons are back! Loved the crew sticking up for their changes to the consoles. Nice touch. It was nicely put together and cleared up a few loose ends from last season while still being mostly self-contained. Bravo.
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Post by Garak Nephew on Jun 15, 2023 15:03:20 GMT
A wholesome Trek episode! Setting aside canon issues with Spock and Chapel, I just enjoyed it a lot. Nice second season start, I wish this crew the best. Bring it on!
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Post by Sehlat Vie on Jun 15, 2023 21:42:28 GMT
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Post by scenario on Jun 16, 2023 2:06:24 GMT
That was superb. I've come to the conclusion you can't reboot a 60 year old show and keep it exactly the same. I like the new Chapple and Spock. The old Chapple would not fit in 2023.
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Post by Prometheus59650 on Jun 16, 2023 3:47:36 GMT
Solid episode. Everyone got a chance to shine, and this show really sticks the landing with a "modern TOS" vibe.
And, yeah, Barrett would have killed to play THIS Chapel.
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Post by Yorick on Jun 16, 2023 8:02:20 GMT
I guess I’m in the minority. I thought it was a really ordinary hour of television. The scene that symbolised the mediocrity of it was the drinking competition between Noonian Singh and the Klingon. Seen that scene too many times. Never need to see it again. Not to say the performances and effects weren’t good, they were. Oh well. Glad you all seemed to enjoy it. Star Trek used to make me think and feel. I’m sure it can again.
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Post by scenario on Jun 16, 2023 14:51:17 GMT
I guess I’m in the minority. I thought it was a really ordinary hour of television. The scene that symbolised the mediocrity of it was the drinking competition between Noonian Singh and the Klingon. Seen that scene too many times. Never need to see it again. Not to say the performances and effects weren’t good, they were. Oh well. Glad you all seemed to enjoy it. Star Trek used to make me think and feel. I’m sure it can again. The episodes that made you think were always the exception. Its impossible to make a relatable story that's brand new. All stories are minor variations on old themes. If you eliminate every scene we've already seen, there's nothing left. I think that Christine mentioning her trip is foreshadowing. She's about to meet her abusive boyfriend who will slowly change her from the bold self assured woman of SNW to the scared, timid woman of TOS. I think the Klingons should be like the Daleks in Doctor Who, one appearance a season. |
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Post by Prometheus59650 on Jun 16, 2023 15:32:29 GMT
I guess I’m in the minority. I thought it was a really ordinary hour of television. The scene that symbolised the mediocrity of it was the drinking competition between Noonian Singh and the Klingon. Seen that scene too many times. Never need to see it again. Not to say the performances and effects weren’t good, they were. Oh well. Glad you all seemed to enjoy it. Star Trek used to make me think and feel. I’m sure it can again. Of course you have. It's all already been done before, the only question is, is this presentation entertaining and I think it was. |
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Post by Prometheus59650 on Jun 16, 2023 15:34:41 GMT
I guess I’m in the minority. I thought it was a really ordinary hour of television. The scene that symbolised the mediocrity of it was the drinking competition between Noonian Singh and the Klingon. Seen that scene too many times. Never need to see it again. Not to say the performances and effects weren’t good, they were. Oh well. Glad you all seemed to enjoy it. Star Trek used to make me think and feel. I’m sure it can again. The episodes that made you think were always the exception. Its impossible to make a relatable story that's brand new. All stories are minor variations on old themes. If you eliminate every scene we've already seen, there's nothing left. I think that Christine mentioning her trip is foreshadowing. She's about to meet her abusive boyfriend who will slowly change her from the bold self assured woman of SNW to the scared, timid woman of TOS. I think the Klingons should be like the Daleks in Doctor Who, one appearance a season. Yeah, I'm pretty sure at this point that, in the same way that they expect you to accept that the way the bridge looks now is the same way that it always looked in 1966, the Chapel you see now was always Chapel, even though it wasn't. |
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Post by Yorick on Jun 16, 2023 19:36:04 GMT
“…they expect you to accept that the way the bridge looks now is the same way that it always looked in 1966…”
But now there’s the pesky old USS New Jersey. I was on board (ha!) with the “it always looked that way” until the trip to the fleet museum.
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Post by ashleytinger on Jun 16, 2023 19:41:53 GMT
I'm looking at it like a comic book series.
Batman is always Batman, but when they change writers and editors, or even the difference between Detective Comics and the main Batman comic, he'll have a slightly different look, car, batcave, depending on the artist and what the editor wants.
Picard wanted a throwback to the classic. That was the editor's choice and the artist followed through.
Disco and SNW wanted something more accessible to current audiences, so the editor had them make some changes to the aesthetic.
It's all still Star Trek, but each editor and artist and series may have a different stamp.
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Post by BeastBoy on Jun 16, 2023 22:34:27 GMT
I'm looking at it like a comic book series. Batman is always Batman. Who is your favorite Batman? My favorite Batman is Terry from "Batman Beyond". |
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Post by nombrecomun on Jun 17, 2023 0:10:39 GMT
I guess I’m in the minority. I thought it was a really ordinary hour of television. The scene that symbolised the mediocrity of it was the drinking competition between Noonian Singh and the Klingon. Seen that scene too many times. Never need to see it again. Not to say the performances and effects weren’t good, they were. Oh well. Glad you all seemed to enjoy it. Star Trek used to make me think and feel. I’m sure it can again. I agree with you. It wasn't anything spectacular BUT it wasn't bad either. Especially in comparison to Picard and DSC. This was simply solid and that's good for me. I did find interesting that it seems the narrative will be split between the Enterprise crew and Pike's personal mission of getting his #1 out of prison. I'm sure these narratives will merge down the road but it felt weird to see the central character not take part for most of the kick off episode of the second season. I'm not much of a fan of Carol Kane. I find her a bit annoying in her voice and mannerisms but somehow it worked as this very quirky character. |
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Post by Sehlat Vie on Jun 17, 2023 0:28:06 GMT
That was superb. I've come to the conclusion you can't reboot a 60 year old show and keep it exactly the same. I like the new Chapple and Spock. The old Chapple would not fit in 2023. Thanks. And yeah, the old Chapel was a doormat, sadly. After seeing her play Mrs. Troi, you can bet that Majel Roddenberry would've given her all in a role like that. Not exactly the season opener I expected, but I enjoyed it very much; with Pike away, the spotlight was well used for the other characters. A true ensemble episode--save for poor Ortegas. Melissa Navia really NEEDS an episode. SOON. |
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Post by ashleytinger on Jun 17, 2023 11:31:45 GMT
I'm looking at it like a comic book series. Batman is always Batman. Who is your favorite Batman? My favorite Batman is Terry from "Batman Beyond". Not trying to derail the discussion but Keaton and West were my first introductions to Batman. That being said, Conroy's Batman from the Animated Series and the few films they did is always my first choice these days. So good. |
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Post by Garak Nephew on Jun 17, 2023 16:28:02 GMT
I really enjoyed this episode. It is like a good appetizer; it is not great as the main dish but it water your mouth for the delicacies to come. In the tradition of DS9, it is a stand alone and it also add info to the micro arcs that are already running (Una's trial, Spock-Chapel impending romance). Some Trek purists might counter that SNW is "ruining" Spock by messing too much around with his emotions. I do not agree with this take. TOS Spock was more firmly grounded in the Vulcan aspects of his personality, while the Spock we see here is still searching, still not completely in control. Trek novelverse explore this very aptly on novels like "Vulcan's Forge" and "Vulcan's Heart" by Josepha Sherman and Susan Shwartz... What I am attempting to communicate is that while it can be argue that TOS was more geared toward Spock "vulcanity" ("the alien among us") SNW is aiming to explore Spock duality. I think it could be a very rich and promising approach.
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Post by nombrecomun on Jun 17, 2023 17:44:19 GMT
...Spock-Chapel impending romance...
I'm probably one of the few people that are 100% against this happening simply because T'Pring is freakin' hot!!!! This character oozed animal sexuality in an interestingly repressed manner. Ok. I'm smitten. I admit it. But in a more serious note I would prefer to see a non-consummated(?) love situation between Spock and Chapel. I don't want to see them hook up. I think this tension is interesting and even more so if somehow they realize this isn't the best for either of them. How does a situation like that get resolved amicably? I'm more interested in that....if I'm even interested in any love relationship dynamics in my scifi to begin with.  |
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Post by Yorick on Jun 18, 2023 19:09:57 GMT
I really enjoyed this episode. It is like a good appetizer; it is not great as the main dish but it water your mouth for the delicacies to come. In the tradition of DS9, it is a stand alone and it also add info to the micro arcs that are already running (Una's trial, Spock-Chapel impending romance). Some Trek purists might counter that SNW is "ruining" Spock by messing too much around with his emotions. I do not agree with this take. TOS Spock was more firmly grounded in the Vulcan aspects of his personality, while the Spock we see here is still searching, still not completely in control. Trek novelverse explore this very aptly on novels like "Vulcan's Forge" and "Vulcan's Heart" by Josepha Sherman and Susan Shwartz... What I am attempting to communicate is that while it can be argue that TOS was more geared toward Spock "vulcanity" ("the alien among us") SNW is aiming to explore Spock duality. I think it could be a very rich and promising approach.
…and the Spock in A Quality of Mercy seems to be more Vulcan. This is what stops me being bothered too much by “out of character” SNW Spock. Maybe this is how he goes from smiling Spock of The Cage, through an emotional journey that eventually compels him on a long path to Kolinar, then back again somewhat until he declares that he has “found himself” in The Undiscovered Country. |
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Post by RobinBland on Jun 23, 2023 13:01:47 GMT
This episode is currently on YouTube for free.
I enjoyed it - a fun romp of a season opener that reestablishes all the main characters well and both ties up a few plot threads from last season and takes a few forward. The characters - and all the players - are so comfortable in their roles now and they’re just great, all of them. This is my absolute fave aspect of SNW, and all Kurtzman-era Trek - these characters. You can forgive a show a lot if you’re into the characters. Ethan Peck’s Spock excels. I like him more and more. Completely different from Nimoy’s and whatever. In my head, this is all a different universe anyway. (See also: Nurse Chapel and probably inevitably Kirk when he properly turns up. How does he not know about the Gorn?)
The bit with M’Benga and Chapel kicking Klingon ass is totally ridiculous, and a bit questionable - why did M’Benga have two handy vials of super-speed about his person? Why don’t Starfleeters have this all the time when fighting Klingons, or other super-strong humanoids? Medical personnel being quite this adept at drug-fueled hand-to-hand combat… eh? Okay. Whatever. (Again.) I’m past examining this stuff too deeply. It was fun.
Great bit: when La’an is on the planet’s surface and the fake Starfleet ship takes off behind her. That was an impressively complex, and very convincing shot.
I guess Galileo (The Galileo 7) wasn’t Spock’s “first command” after all. Continuity, schmontinuity.
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Post by scenario on Jun 23, 2023 19:28:26 GMT
This episode is currently on YouTube for free. I enjoyed it - a fun romp of a season opener that reestablishes all the main characters well and both ties up a few plot threads from last season and takes a few forward. The characters - and all the players - are so comfortable in their roles now and they’re just great, all of them. This is my absolute fave aspect of SNW, and all Kurtzman-era Trek - these characters. You can forgive a show a lot if you’re into the characters. Ethan Peck’s Spock excels. I like him more and more. Completely different from Nimoy’s and whatever. In my head, this is all a different universe anyway. (See also: Nurse Chapel and probably inevitably Kirk when he properly turns up. How does he not know about the Gorn?) The bit with M’Benga and Chapel kicking Klingon ass is totally ridiculous, and a bit questionable - why did M’Benga have two handy vials of super-speed about his person? Why don’t Starfleeters have this all the time when fighting Klingons, or other super-strong humanoids? Medical personnel being quite this adept at drug-fueled hand-to-hand combat… eh? Okay. Whatever. (Again.) I’m past examining this stuff too deeply. It was fun. Great bit: when La’an is on the planet’s surface and the fake Starfleet ship takes off behind her. That was an impressively complex, and very convincing shot. I guess Galileo (The Galileo 7) wasn’t Spock’s “first command” after all. Continuity, schmontinuity. Last season when M'Benga was trying to save his daughter he invented a lot of serums. My head canon is that he invented the Berserker juice himself but didn't tell anyone because it is very dangerous, i.e. heart attacks or turned users psychotic if overused. Its all part of his mysterious and brutal past. Spock wasn't officially in command. He was sitting a watch in dry dock. Plus no one told Kirk about the time Spock stole the Enterprise the first time. Everyone just pretended it didn't happen. The ship was officially on a shakedown run. Spock wasn't in command because it never happened. |
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I am so sorry...
Jul 14, 2024 1:18:27 GMT
I am so sorry...
Jul 14, 2024 1:18:27 GMT